The Squeal by Jack Cummins

Baden December 16, 2024 at 17:11 175 views 40 comments
It had been a heavy therapy session. I had spoken about broken relationships and the pain of so much rejection. I descended the staircase in a haze of black and blue melancholy, saying goodbye to my therapist, Charlotte. I opened the front door, went through it and closed it behind me. As the door closed I thought that I heard a small scream or squeal. It was probably my trickster imagination. I didn't look round and went to the shopping centre, to immerse myself in trivia.

I got on with my studies and my job as a numbing distraction from anguish over so many harsh experiences. Two days before my next therapy session, I got a text from Charlotte, saying that she was cancelling it because she had a health problem. At least, it gave me an extra afternoon to work on my essay in the library. A week later, I got another text to say that the next session would go ahead as usual.

When arriving for this, Charlotte opened the door and I noticed that she was wearing a black covering on one finger, like a shiny black condom. I was wondering what happened. I began to worry had I hurt her finger closing the door and hearing a small scream. Of course, she could have tripped over or cut her finger inside the house. But worse, I could have severed her finger and she had to have it regrafted. Beyond the therapy session, in which I went through with my usual moans and groans, the worry prodded at me through the coming week.

On the following week, Charlotte was still wearing the black finger covering. I was unsure whether to mention my own worry over it. I went as far as to say,
'I feel so guilty all the time. When you were off sick I blamed myself'.
She did not reply but she was often silent. Also, I was often silenced too by the vulnerability of lying on the couch, which seemed like a cot or a pram. The rest of the session was only filled with sporadic interaction.

She never wore the black covering again but wore a small plaster for a while. I kept visiting her large house, covered by dark leaves, for another year. The therapy didn't seem to be going anywhere, as if we were at an impasse. Some say that in therapy, everything gets worse before it gets better. I am not sure about this myth. I couldn't afford to keep paying for therapy indefinitely. When I said I was terminating, Charlotte queried this but seemed a bit relieved, stating that she planned to retire fairly soon.

I still think about her, with her long, straight raven black hair, and, of course, the issue of her finger. I can almost hear and feel the sharp crack of a breaking bone and shudderr. If I really did break it was it my fault and did I wish, subconsciously, to wound her? Or, was she wishing to hurt herself by sticking a finger through the doorway? I don't know how to separate pain, mine and hers, physical and emotional. It all seems hazy, like the uncertainty of hearing the squeal. Perhaps, Charlotte represents the phallic mother, poking her finger in an accusational, punishing way. Did she wish to castrate me of my ego power and fragile male identity?

I am walking through a subway and see a girl crouching down, begging passers by for change. I put a few coins into her hand and, I notice that she is wearing a bandage around a finger. Immediately, I feel that I wish to get to know her and her pain, as if destiny is calling me. I invite her to a cafe for a coffee. She nods and smiles. She clutches hold of my arm as we cross the busy road and I am unsure whether we will help each other or whether I am meeting a seductive sorceress, lured by the wounded finger and my need to make amends for Charlotte's wound.

Comments (40)

Noble Dust December 17, 2024 at 02:55 #954029
I can relate to the overthinking of the protagonist, wondering absurdly if he had accidentally chopped his therapists finger off by closing the door on it. It can be hard to express these sorts of ridiculous, private trails of thought that happen. The author does it pretty effortlessly, so kudos on that.

Quoting Baden
If I really did break it was it my fault and did I wish, subconsciously, to wound her? Or, was she wishing to hurt herself by sticking a finger through the doorway?


An interesting psychological turn that perhaps one or both people wanted to get hurt or experience pain, maybe through the process of therapy? Who is getting more out of the sessions, the therapist or the patient? Are both searching for healing, or instead to just feel anything at all, including pain?

I do like the weird synchronicity of meeting the homeless girl with a bandaged finger at the end. I'm not sure what it signifies though.

Interesting story overall. It feels very much like a friend relating an odd real life experience to me, rather than a writer crafting a story using traditional storytelling tools. I think I like that change of pace though.

Little details like this:

Quoting Baden
I kept visiting her large house, covered by dark leaves


Seem unnecessary and out of place, unless the story is read as a casual real life story told in passing, as I mentioned above. Read this way it fits well.
hypericin December 17, 2024 at 08:59 #954068
Quoting Noble Dust
Seem unnecessary and out of place, unless the story is read as a casual real life story told in passing, as I mentioned above. Read this way it fits well.


I agree with your review except for this part. It seems weirdly backwards: if a friend was telling you this story, it would be incredibly odd for them to point that out. This kind of detail only has a place in a written story.

I count only four pieces of visual imagery in the whole story, all off them dark:

A haze of black and blue melancholy
A black covering on one finger, like a shiny black condom
Covered by dark leaves
Long, straight Raven black hair (maybe incongruous with retiring)

I think it fits, and is needed, and fits into a theme of dark imagery. Was that intentional?
Amity December 17, 2024 at 11:52 #954089
The Squeal

What kind of squeal and why? Of delight or pain? Or is it the 'squeal' of an informant? To tell about some wrong-doing?

Quoting Baden
I had spoken about broken relationships and the pain of so much rejection. I descended the staircase in a haze of black and blue melancholy, saying goodbye to my therapist, Charlotte.


The protagonist tells and shows the effects of a 'heavy therapy session' seemingly without any relief or darkness being lifted. Is it worth it? If not, why does he still go?

Quoting Baden
As the door closed I thought that I heard a small scream or squeal. It was probably my trickster imagination. I didn't look round and went to the shopping centre, to immerse myself in trivia.


Immersed in his own thoughts, he is somehow unsure whether the squeal is real? Why would he not check? He needed an immediate break, a get-away to matters of less concern.

Then, the contrast of serious study with a light-weight job, perhaps to finance his course?
He experiences mental pain and looks for distraction, perhaps a way to understand via knowledge.
Learning is important. But he can't solve his problems alone, he sees Charlotte, the therapist, regularly.
Is this a non-threatening way of finding female comfort.

It seems that Charlotte, too, is unwell. And cancels the next meeting. He appears philosophical, and focuses on the benefits. More time to write an academic essay. The squeal forgotten. Until:

Quoting Baden
Charlotte opened the door and I noticed that she was wearing a black covering on one finger, like a shiny black condom. I was wondering what happened. I began to worry had I hurt her finger closing the door and hearing a small scream. Of course, she could have tripped over or cut her finger inside the house. But worse, I could have severed her finger and she had to have it regrafted. Beyond the therapy session, in which I went through with my usual moans and groans, the worry prodded at me through the coming week.


Interesting interjection of sexual imagery. Why black?
He didn't show any external concern or ask why. Still immersed in his own 'squeals' of misery.
He tries to rationalise what could have happened. He is caught up in his imagination. Not dealing with reality. His worry continues because he didn't know how to relate to his therapist. Happy with going over old ground. The repetitions. What had she to say in all of this? Nothing?

It seems that she 'was often silent' even when he expressed his concern,

Quoting Baden
'I feel so guilty all the time. When you were off sick I blamed myself' [...] I was often silenced too by the vulnerability of lying on the couch, which seemed like a cot or a pram. The rest of the session was only filled with sporadic interaction.


It doesn't seem like the setting has a positive therapeutic effect. Charlotte as a mother to his inner child?
Nevertheless, he returns again and again. To this dark place, for another year. If it wasn't serious, you would have to laugh at how long it took to recognise the 'impasse'. How bad or deep does it need to go before things improve.

Quoting Baden
She never wore the black covering again but wore a small plaster for a while. I kept visiting her large house, covered by dark leaves, for another year. [...] I couldn't afford to keep paying for therapy indefinitely. When I said I was terminating, Charlotte queried this but seemed a bit relieved, stating that she planned to retire fairly soon.


Even so, he can't break free from an obsession. Her 'long, straight raven black hair' and black finger. Perhaps, broken and dead. He vividly feels the memory of that moment. The togetherness in pain.

Quoting Baden
If I really did break it was it my fault and did I wish, subconsciously, to wound her? Or, was she wishing to hurt herself by sticking a finger through the doorway? I don't know how to separate pain, mine and hers, physical and emotional. It all seems hazy, like the uncertainty of hearing the squeal. Perhaps, Charlotte represents the phallic mother, poking her finger in an accusational, punishing way. Did she wish to castrate me of my ego power and fragile male identity?


Ah, so yes, a mother figure. The protagonist knows his Freudian psychology. Is that helpful, or not?
And again, the author uses psychology. Jung's synchronicity. This time, introducing the protagonist as a hero who notices and cares about a beggar girl and her wounded finger. A sense of destiny.

Quoting Baden
I feel that I wish to get to know her and her pain, as if destiny is calling me. I invite her to a cafe for a coffee. She nods and smiles. She clutches hold of my arm as we cross the busy road and I am unsure whether we will help each other or whether I am meeting a seductive sorceress, lured by the wounded finger and my need to make amends for Charlotte's wound.


Perhaps, he is finding light at the end of a dark tunnel? The tables turned. But they can turn again...

***

A story very well told. Intriguing symbolism and engaging. Well done :flower: :up:

















javi2541997 December 17, 2024 at 12:17 #954091
In fact, I also perceived the overthinking by the protagonist, as @Noble Dust stated. It is well written and evolved. Kudos to the writer on grasping the psychological state.

It is hard to see whether the plot is melancholic or regretting. It is interesting, because I think the emotional behaviour of the character is evolving. First, the hesitation in hearing the small scream or not; and then, admitting that was probably certain and how everything went through since then.

A great short story. Congratulations. I would like to know more from the author, when the names will be released.
Vera Mont December 17, 2024 at 15:41 #954116
once you're in the analysis mind-set, everything becomes a psychological investigation. that's deftly depicted here; it shows fine understanding of the thought-process. i was convinced, too, by the protagonist's reluctance to ask : it's the therapist supposed to delve into the patent's life, not the other way. a very well balanced observation of that relationship. and i very much appreciate how his concern for another person draws him out of his self-preoccupation to take an interest in a more accessible other person. it's a sensitive, understated piece, well constructed and written
Noble Dust December 17, 2024 at 16:49 #954134
Quoting hypericin
I agree with your review except for this part. It seems weirdly backwards: if a friend was telling you this story, it would be incredibly odd for them to point that out. This kind of detail only has a place in a written story.


No you're right; my line of thought was a bit scrambled, but you untangled it. So in reality, that detail, which belongs in a written story, feels out of place in this story, because this story feels like an orally related tale.
praxis December 17, 2024 at 16:49 #954135
Well written and interesting, and I want to say it feels complete even though it’s very short.

It seems like there’s more to it that I can’t quite grasp, something to do with “the uncertainty of hearing the squeal” perhaps, or perhaps the author means to trick the reader into grasping at straws.
Noble Dust December 17, 2024 at 16:52 #954137
Quoting Vera Mont
once you're in the analysis mind-set, everything becomes a psychological investigation. that's deftly depicted here;


Good point, I was trying to put my finger on that and didn't quite make the connection.
Christoffer December 17, 2024 at 16:57 #954138
I liked this one for its simplicity. It's basically a ranting mind about a single event taking over everything like a Emmanuel Carrère or Beckett story.

And the irony of how the event and uncertainty of the finger snap becomes such an issue that the entire time period spent at the therapist just puts him in a feedback loop of agony over guilt, prompting him into amateur analysis of himself rather than actually and truly engaging with Charlotte about it all.

This kind of feedback loop of thinking becoming such an obsession makes it pretty good in this very short form. It doesn't need to be longer and manage to tell the entire point.

I'd say there were parts that could use another rewrite, but it's just minor stuff, overall it flowed nicely and kept a balance of things.

Good job!
Jack Cummins December 19, 2024 at 08:16 #954547
Reply to Amity
It is interesting to wonder what a squeal represents, whether it is a cry of pain or pleasure, or even ambiguity of the two. The story looks at ambiguity, such as in idea of the phallic mother.

Generally, I see the story as being a questioning of therapy and the relationship between the analyst and client. The narrator definitely seems to be an over thinker, despite a long period of therapy and lying on the couch.
Nils Loc December 19, 2024 at 17:13 #954638
Quoting Vera Mont
i was convinced, too, by the protagonist's reluctance to ask : it's the therapist supposed to delve into the patent's life, not the other way.


But the hurt finger is such a minor thing to ask about. It's not as if he's delving into her sex life. Maybe the subtext tells us as much, that this relationship is ambiguously sexualized if only in the mind of the neurotic protagonist. If he believed he caused the injury he should press the issue, unless both therapist and client really know what is going on and we aren't in on it.





Christoffer December 19, 2024 at 17:22 #954639
Quoting Nils Loc
But the hurt finger is such a minor thing to ask about. It's not as if he's delving into her sex life. Maybe the subtext tells us as much, that this relationship is ambiguously sexualized if only in the mind of the neurotic protagonist. If he believed he caused the injury he should press the issue, unless both therapist and client really know what is going on.


I find it that people act more in line with this story than they would ever ask straight out like that. People tend to dwell on minor things to have guilt about, it's pretty on point with why people go to therapy in the first place; they are bad at handling things that some might consider easy to "just do". Especially if time has gone by, raising the issue later seems to be embarrassing for him.

It's why I feel there's an irony in that his dwelling on this thing hurts his ability to engage in his therapy, it's like the issue is staring in his face and he doesn't realize it.
Vera Mont December 19, 2024 at 18:00 #954647
Quoting Nils Loc
But the hurt finger is such a minor thing to ask about. It's not as if he's delving into her sex life. Maybe the subtext tells us as much, that this relationship is ambiguously sexualized if only in the mind of the neurotic protagonist. If he believed he caused the injury he should press the issue, unless both therapist and client really know what is going on and we aren't in on it.

a friend of mine was in therapy for two years, and would never have dared mention the shrink's bandaged finger. it's like a child's relationship to a teacher: you constantly wonder and conjecture about their personal life, but you never, ever get personal. it's like a taboo - probably because in the patient's mind, the relationship very often is sexualized. in reality, and the patient knows this, the power balance is heavily lopsided. and ambiguous. it doesn't matter what an objective observer thinks he ought to do; he can only see the situation from his own skewed pov.
Nils Loc December 19, 2024 at 18:22 #954652
Quoting Vera Mont
it's like a child's relationship to a teacher: you constantly wonder and conjecture about their personal life, but you never, ever get personal. it's like a taboo


So much for open conversation. I don't think I'm averse to asking therapists personal questions of a trifling sort, especially if they concern me. The therapist can tell you when you've crossed a line. But I do understand this as more the self-limiting neurosis of the protagonist.

Quoting Christoffer
dwelling on this thing hurts his ability to engage in his therapy


Yes, and his inability to air it. It's odd that one could organize enough to go to therapy, spend the dough, establish a rapport over years, and then not be able to ask about a such a trifle. If he speaks his mind to his therapist, she'll more likely be able to help him.

Christoffer December 19, 2024 at 18:27 #954654
Quoting Nils Loc
It's odd that one could organize enough to go to therapy, spend the dough, establish a rapport over years, and then not be able to ask about a such a trifle.


Isn't that what most lives are like? People wandering through complex, but repetitious and routine tasks only to fall to their knees and cry in despair and terror at the most minor deviation from the comfort of that sleepwalking existence? :sweat:
Amity December 19, 2024 at 18:37 #954656
Quoting Vera Mont
it's like a taboo - probably because in the patient's mind, the relationship very often is sexualized. in reality, and the patient knows this, the power balance is heavily lopsided. and ambiguous. it doesn't matter what an objective observer thinks he ought to do; he can only see the situation from his own skewed pov.


Yes. There is a clear sexual attraction and I'm not sure it isn't mutual. At any rate, there is a tension and a silence until he offloads his squeals. He probably knows himself better than she ever could. She just listens. And takes his money.
Amity December 19, 2024 at 18:44 #954657
Quoting Jack Cummins
It is interesting to wonder what a squeal represents, whether it is a cry of pain or pleasure, or even ambiguity of the two. The story looks at ambiguity, such as in idea of the phallic mother.

Generally, I see the story as being a questioning of therapy and the relationship between the analyst and client. The narrator definitely seems to be an over thinker, despite a long period of therapy and lying on the couch.


Speaking from experience? :wink:
Vera Mont December 19, 2024 at 20:27 #954668
Quoting Nils Loc
So much for open conversation.


only, it's neither open nor a conversation. it's a lopsided relationship in which the needy, insecure person cedes his own power to the person in control, and projects his feelings about everyone he loves, reveres and fears onto this authority figure. the confidences all go one way. think priest confessor and congregant. if he tried asking, he could expect an answer like 'why does my finger interest you?' and he fears not having a rational answer as much as fears being rebuffed. at least that's how it works in the version that was described to me [far too many times in far too much detail] chronic patients can become quite obsessive about their therapist and i suspect the protagonist is just such a patient. these are not reasoned, considered decisions; they're neurotic responses.
Janus December 19, 2024 at 23:07 #954705
I enjoyed this simple straightforward story. The neurotic obsession with self-blame and its strange linking with notions of destiny. After the apparently unsuccessful relationship with the therapist (was the inability to keep paying for therapy merely an excuse?) the protagonist takes up with another wounded soul wondering whether they will help one another or whether he will just be used by "another seductive sorceress".

The protagonist's speculations about whether he had unconsciously wanted to wound the therapist or whether she unconsciously wished to wound herself linked with the somewhat paranoid thought that she may have wanted to or castrate him. His "ideas of reference" remain in the realm of neurosis, but I imagine them possibly veering into psychotic "delusions of reference", This gives the story so matter-of-factly told a potentially sinister edge. I liked the open-endedness of the conclusion.
Jack Cummins December 23, 2024 at 21:27 #955321
The character here may be so frustrating and weak. The narrator is locked into a broken solipiticism, in which he can barely see the perspective of the therapist. The portrayal of the therapist also suggests a similar deficit. The story explores this but may be weak in not drawing out the issues fully, leaving too much to the reader. It tries to show rather than tell, but probably doesn't go far enough in trying to depict the psychological aspects emerging in therapy.
Caldwell December 24, 2024 at 03:00 #955356
This is a good writing on the first-person perspective of a mental processes of someone with a compulsion for obsessive thoughts. OCD at its best.
I've seen this done on films, through the perspective of the protagonist. With the right skills of the writer, it works all the time. I mean, no one else could go inside the mind of a person but the person himself.

Quoting Baden
When arriving for this, Charlotte opened the door and I noticed that she was wearing a black covering on one finger, like a shiny black condom. I was wondering what happened. I began to worry had I hurt her finger closing the door and hearing a small scream. Of course, she could have tripped over or cut her finger inside the house. But worse, I could have severed her finger and she had to have it regrafted. Beyond the therapy session, in which I went through with my usual moans and groans, the worry prodded at me through the coming week.

Here is the thought in action of how our protagonist has immediately connected the finger with a bandage to the event that happened days or weeks prior. A lot of obsessive thoughts about it, and it progresses from bad to worse.

Good job!
Baden December 24, 2024 at 09:12 #955384
The incident that initiates the narrative has potential, but I think the story could have been developed more to get the reader more interested in the main characters. While I can definitely relate to the obsessive nature of the main protagonist's concern, I found myself not really caring about him or his therapist. The ending also seems a bit contrived. I like some of the images though, like the shiny black condom and the idea of there being some psychological lesson to all of this. But the story as it stands doesn't really come together in a meaningful way for me.
Caldwell December 25, 2024 at 20:23 #955567
Quoting Baden
The incident that initiates the narrative has potential, but I think the story could have been developed more to get the reader more interested in the main characters.

Yes.
Tobias December 26, 2024 at 23:20 #955795
Hmmm, it is interesting, actually the responses from the analysts are as interesting to me as the story itself is. I wondered immediately why he would not just ask. I have met my fair share of psychologists and would have immediately asked. It is something he really needs to know and I can relate to that. It is also quite innocuous, it is her finger... But then, reading your responses, I understand that just asking is not a common thing to do... I would have like a bit more meat on the bones, to be able to judge the character better for myself.

That said, I liked the erotic tension of the situation and the fact that this eroticism is totally locked into the main character. He does not reach out, but instead becomes a very inarticulate character in the presence of 'Charlotte' his therapist. She has a name, she has raven black hair, she exudes presence, he emptiness.
He reaches out eventually but to a 'girl', who is 'homeless', contrary to the named, feminine, well housed Charlotte. The story is about a man who does not play the game of recognition because he is frightened about it. He only dares this with a figure devoid of any power and even then he is afraid of being 'seduced' by a 'sorceress'....

It is an inspiring story
Noble Dust December 26, 2024 at 23:39 #955801
Quoting Tobias
He reaches out eventually but to a 'girl', who is 'homeless', contrary to the names, feminine, well housed Charlotte. The story is about a man who does not play the game of recognition because he is frightened about it. He only dares this with a figure devoid of any power and even then he is afraid of being 'seduced' by a 'sorceress'....


Aha, this is the bit I could intuit but couldn’t quite put my finger on. Well said.
Jack Cummins December 29, 2024 at 08:43 #956320
Thanks to all for the useful feedback and it seems that many guessed that I wrote it. I appreciate criticisms because I don't see this as a finished 'polished' story. It is more of a work in progress, which I started in a creative writing group and developed a little further.

What I was really wishing to explore was the psychotherapy idea of transference and countertransference. This is the way in which so much is projected onto the therapist as the transference. Alongside this, there is the concept of the countertransference which is the way the inner world of the client is felt by the therapist.

I don't think that I managed to pull this off fully in the story. It probably would need to be much longer( and my story was much shorter than most here). It is not that I am too lazy to write more, but struggling with doing all of this on my phone. Maybe I will get a new digital device, although I actually find prefer writing in pen in notebooks.

I also wonder if this had been written in third person, with a view to an equal journey into Charlotte's inner world would it have worked better? But, as it is, it was meant to be a snapshot into the world of therapy, as I did wish and begin training in therapy at one stage. Training to be a therapist is a long and hard quest and I didn't finish the training.
Amity December 29, 2024 at 09:39 #956326
Quoting Jack Cummins
I appreciate criticisms because I don't see this as a finished 'polished' story. It is more of a work in progress, which I started in a creative writing group and developed a little further.


I think all stories can be seen as a work-in-progress. Even if they are considered 'polished'. Writing is an art and serious writers progress through practice and receiving feedback.

Recently, Baden had fun when he quoted the philosopher 'Leotard'. I looked him up:

Quoting Jean-Francois Lyotard - Wiki
In a 1984 interview with Georges Van Den Abbeele, Lyotard discusses how he views all the work he's published as rough drafts, noting that,"Even Le différend (1984), which I spent nine years elaborating and writing, remains a sketch, whose master I have not been. And in this sense, I can without lying plead limited responsibility. That is to say: a reader cannot incorrectly locate in a piece of writing an aspect which, according to me, is not at all there.


Isn't that interesting? He viewed all his published work as 'rough drafts'.

Quoting Jack Cummins
It is not that I am too lazy to write more, but struggling with doing all of this on my phone. Maybe I will get a new digital device, although I actually find prefer writing in pen in notebooks.


Nobody can accuse you of laziness. You contribute much to the philosophy pages.
The phone screen is not big enough for all your projects and must seriously affect your eyes.
At least, invest in a tablet. I like Samsung. I also scribble in lined A4 notebooks, not always keeping to the lines!

Quoting Jack Cummins
it was meant to be a snapshot into the world of therapy, as I did wish and begin training in therapy at one stage. Training to be a therapist is a long and hard quest and I didn't finish the training.


It worked very well as a snapshot. Perhaps there are less demanding therapies that work just as well?

Quoting Jack Cummins
What I was really wishing to explore was the psychotherapy idea of transference and countertransference. This is the way in which so much is projected onto the therapist as the transference. Alongside this, there is the concept of the countertransference which is the way the inner world of the client is felt by the therapist.


It is fascinating to consider what might be going through the mind of a therapist.
Do we really want to know if they are having sexual fantasies or wondering what to have for lunch?
I think we can detect those who really care. Those who listen carefully and respond to clarify their understanding.

Anyway, I enjoyed your story very much. Do you still attend creative writing groups?




Jack Cummins December 29, 2024 at 13:43 #956344
Reply to Amity
Lyotard's perspective is useful for thinking about 'rough drafts' is useful for thinking about the writing process. Editing is so important and is a in it's own right. It can be painful though, as I can remember having to make changes on dissertations. Perhaps, it can be more fun with stories as they can be revisioned and even evolve into something entirely new.

The question as to whether people may wish to see into the therapist's inner one is a good one. That is because it may interfere with the mystique surrounding therapy and the therapist which is at the centre of psychodynamic therapy. There are some therapies which are possibly less demanding. There are many forms of therapy based on cognitive behavioral therapy techniques.

Dare I say, one of the latest trends is online therapies, which says so much about the digital age, of people alone in rooms using devices for everything. I did have a tablet at one stage but I think that it had a worse effect on my eyes because I was using it for longer periods. There is also a recognised phenomena of 'bed rotting', which is about people lying in bed using digital devices on a 24 basis, which is meant to be extremely unhealthy mentally and physically. It does involve so much isolation. For that reason, I go to groups, including creative writing. Using sites, such as this one are good but need a balance. Community hubs are becoming popular because people need people rather than digital interaction alone.
Amity December 29, 2024 at 14:13 #956346
Quoting Jack Cummins
It can be painful though, as I can remember having to make changes on dissertations. Perhaps, it can be more fun with stories as they can be revisioned and even evolve into something entirely new.


Changes: I'm smiling at this and how my story began and how it ended, still in a heap of confusion.
The chaos of a spinning mind had to be reined in. The writing went through different forms and stages.

Academic essays are on another level. You start with an idea or thesis, sometimes the title is even provided. You are given guidance as to how it should relate to the course readings. And so on.
You know what the examiner is looking for, and write to please the markers.

Both are challenging and can be fun, But yes, it is a mix of pleasure and pain.

Quoting Jack Cummins
There are many forms of therapy based on cognitive behavioral therapy techniques.


I think that CBT or a variant can be most effective for some. We've talked of it before in relation to philosophy.

Quoting Jack Cummins
For that reason, I go to groups, including creative writing. Using sites, such as this one are good but need a balance. Community hubs are becoming popular because people need people rather than digital interaction alone.


That is good to hear. I was under the impression that community services were being cut back. People need people. Yes, indeed.

Quoting Jack Cummins
The question as to whether people may wish to see into the therapist's inner one is a good one. That is because it may interfere with the mystique surrounding therapy and the therapist which is at the centre of psychodynamic therapy.


I wonder if people do see the therapist as someone mystical with all the answers?
I don't.
They are people like us. Perhaps with a bit more training, knowledge and insight but it is up to the individual to do the work. To think things through after a prompt or pertinent question.

Oh but that is psychiatry or psychology, not psychodynamic therapy, right?






Jack Cummins December 29, 2024 at 17:13 #956380
Reply to Amity
The 'spinning mind' of the writing process can be exciting, watching and seeing what emerges amidst confusion and chaos. Academic writing has its place but it can become so dry. There is the inbetween world of creative non fiction, which can be a crossover, incorporating the two. Truman Capote's, 'In Cold Blood' is an example. Also, I once read a fictionalised version of the story of Lena Zavaroni, which I found inspirational.

Psychology, psychiatry and psychotherapy, as separate areas are an interesting area for a fiction, because the academic, evidence-based approach may miss the essential aspects of experience. Fiction allows for juxtaposition and blending, as an overview of the psychological dimension, with fictional characters being created rather than talking about specific individuals. This is where fiction wins because it can be extremely problematic to write about actual living people in an identifiable way.
Vera Mont December 29, 2024 at 19:12 #956424
Quoting Jack Cummins
What I was really wishing to explore was the psychotherapy idea of transference and countertransference.

The transference came through beautifully. I particularly liked the transference of concern for the therapist to the young woman with an injured finger. I thought that very neatly done.

Adding the extra dimension of the therapist's POV might have been overwhelming. What people seemed to grapple with is why the patient doesn't react as if he and the therapist were on an equal footing. But that can never be so, can it? Two people's complex and opposite take on this power relationship is too great a burden for a short story.
You might look at developing a little more (I mean, a little; don't explain too much) the feeling of inadequacy a patient may have toward the near-omnipotent therapist. There is a constant tension between trying to reduce the therapist to human dimensions and building them up to something god-like. The way young children often feel about their fathers.... or used, when fathers had more clout.
Caldwell December 29, 2024 at 23:15 #956502
Quoting Jack Cummins
What I was really wishing to explore was the psychotherapy idea of transference and countertransference. This is the way in which so much is projected onto the therapist as the transference. Alongside this, there is the concept of the countertransference which is the way the inner world of the client is felt by the therapist.

I don't think that I managed to pull this off fully in the story. It probably would need to be much longer( and my story was much shorter than most here).

Yes, this is missing, if this is what you'd wanted to accomplish. In that regard, the story is still a work-in-progress.
Jack Cummins December 30, 2024 at 17:33 #956732
Reply to Caldwell
I was definitely wishing to hint at the idea of the transference, but I am uncertain how far I would wish to go with that. It may be that thinking about the idea is only important for therapists to think about fully. I would imagine that how much this is picked up on according to experience of therapy one has or or not had.

I am uncertain whether it is even useful for people in therapy to stop and consider the transference or countertransference. I probably wrote it, as @Vera Mont spoke of hers, as a process of 'exorcism', because I got a bit disillusioned with the world of therapy. I am not sure to what extent I will follow through with the story further although I do see therapy as a fascinating topic for fiction and, will wait and see what erupts in my life and subconscious in the New Year....Otherwise, it has been shared at least and may rest and be buried...
Vera Mont December 30, 2024 at 19:33 #956767
Judith Rossner wrote a novel titled 'August' , back in 1983; I don't know how relevant it is to analysis today. My own second-hand experience goes back to the early 2000's, but it doesn't seem very different from my very brief first-hand experience in the 70's ... The transference situation seems to remain constant. It is an interesting subject to explore, as is the whole relationship between patient and therapist. I hope you continue to explore the topic.
Caldwell December 31, 2024 at 03:09 #956899
Quoting Jack Cummins
I am not sure to what extent I will follow through with the story further although I do see therapy as a fascinating topic for fiction and, will wait and see what erupts in my life and subconscious


Quoting Vera Mont
Judith Rossner wrote a novel titled 'August' , back in 1983;

There is also the short story The Yellow Wallpaper by Charlotte Perkins Gilman. This is a dark, first-person narrative of the patient with no happy ending. The patient is the wife of the therapist. The story progressed within a confined room, the bedroom.
It's a fascinating writing, a difficult one, indeed. To assert her 'awareness' of the 'truth' of what's happening to her, she descended deeper and deeper to complete mental illness.



Vera Mont December 31, 2024 at 03:17 #956902
Reply to Caldwell Not a great recommendation for therapy - or marrying a shrink, I suppose. Still, another interesting perspective on the process. I can't think why this still holds a fascination for me after all these years. Minds, I guess; what makes people tick.
Caldwell December 31, 2024 at 03:30 #956903
Quoting Vera Mont
I can't think why this still holds a fascination for me after all these years. Minds, I guess; what makes people tick.

:smile: I don't know if you believe the findings that show that there's a good number of people in high-powered positions within an organization that have sociopathic tendencies.
Vera Mont December 31, 2024 at 03:51 #956905
Quoting Caldwell
don't know if you believe the findings that show that there's a good number of people in high-powered positions within an organization that have sociopathic tendencies.


Anybody can find anything anywhere, if they look hard enough. Which organizations have been studied? What is a sociopathic tendency? Haven't we all got one or two of those in the bottom drawer?
Jack Cummins January 02, 2025 at 17:20 #957678
Reply to Amity
I may not have answered your questions in your detailed review. The black condom was meant to be gothic (or emo). The sexual imagery was meant to be about the Freudian background and the 'phallic mother' was drawing together ideas in the psychoanalytic tradition, including Lacan's emphasis on the 'phallus' as a symbol.

You also asked about whether I was talking about therapy from experience, which I didn't answer because I had not disclosed that I was the author. It is a fiction but based on having had therapy for 4 years. The therapist worked from a mixture of psychodynamic and Jungian background.

For over 6 months, I did lie on the couch at the recommendation of the therapist and during this time both myself and the therapist had a fair amount of time in silence. The unspoken is important, although both therapist and client may experience it differently from one another.

Amity January 13, 2025 at 13:57 #960340
Reply to Jack Cummins

Thank you for explaining more about your wonderful story. I respect your openness and showing in your own voice, some autobiographical elements. It makes this piece of art even more compelling. :flower: